Following the events of 9/11, Gordon B. Hinckley made reference to the Gadianton robbers in his October 2001 general conference talk.1 Here is an excerpt of his comments:
Now we are at war. Great forces have been mobilized and will continue to be. Political alliances are being forged. We do not know how long this conflict will last. We do not know what it will cost in lives and treasure. We do not know the manner in which it will be carried out. It could impact the work of the Church in various ways.
Our national economy has been made to suffer. It was already in trouble, and this has compounded the problem. Many are losing their employment. Among our own people, this could affect welfare needs and also the tithing of the Church. It could affect our missionary program.
We are now a global organization. We have members in more than 150 nations. Administering this vast worldwide program could conceivably become more difficult.
Those of us who are American citizens stand solidly with the president of our nation. The terrible forces of evil must be confronted and held accountable for their actions. This is not a matter of Christian against Muslim. I am pleased that food is being dropped to the hungry people of a targeted nation. We value our Muslim neighbors across the world and hope that those who live by the tenets of their faith will not suffer. I ask particularly that our own people do not become a party in any way to the persecution of the innocent. Rather, let us be friendly and helpful, protective and supportive. It is the terrorist organizations that must be ferreted out and brought down.
We of this Church know something of such groups. The Book of Mormon speaks of the Gadianton robbers, a vicious, oath-bound, and secret organization bent on evil and destruction. In their day they did all in their power, by whatever means available, to bring down the Church, to woo the people with sophistry, and to take control of the society. We see the same thing in the present situation.
We are people of peace. We are followers of the Christ who was and is the Prince of Peace. But there are times when we must stand up for right and decency, for freedom and civilization, just as Moroni rallied his people in his day to the defense of their wives, their children, and the cause of liberty (see Alma 48:10).
The Gadianton Robbers & Critics of the Church
The Gadianton Robbers play a prominent role in the Book of Mormon. According to Moroni, the editor and compiler of the Book of Mormon:
And behold, in the end of this book ye shall see that this Gadianton did prove the overthrow, yea, almost the entire destruction of the people of Nephi. (Helaman 2:13).
President Hinckley noted that the Gadianton robbers sought to “bring down the Church” in the Book of Mormon and “we see the same thing in the present situation.” In the April 1997 general conference, he talked openly about the critics of the Church:
We have been reminded that ours is a great inheritance. The past is behind us. It is the future with which we must be concerned. We face great opportunities and great challenges. Our critics at home and abroad are watching us. In an effort to find fault, they listen to every word we say, hoping to entrap us. We may stumble now and again. But the work will not be materially hindered. We will stand up where we fell and go forward.2
Then in April 2001 – some five months previous to the events of 9/11 – he reminded us again of these critics. He said:
We are not without critics, some of whom are mean and vicious. We have always had them, and I suppose we will have them all through the future. But we shall go forward, returning good for evil, being helpful and kind and generous. I remind you of the teachings of our Lord concerning these matters. You are all acquainted with them. Let us be good people. Let us be friendly people. Let us be neighborly people. Let us be what members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints ought to be.3
In October of the same year, President Hinckley noted that the Gadianton robbers seek to:
- Bring down the Church.
- Woo the people with sophistry.
- Take control of society.
In this talk, he made it very clear that, “this is not a matter of Christian against Muslim.”
Subsequent to 9/11
Since 9/11, U.S. military action has been directed against the predominantly Muslim nations of Iraq and Afghanistan.
Certainly, the events of 9/11 were acts of “consummate evil.” But it is unlikely that Muslim terrorists acting in behalf of Al Qaeda had it as their intent to destroy the Church, embark on a campaign to deceive the American public, or gain control of society.
Since September 11, U.S. citizens have seen the creation of two massive federal “security” agencies and an abrogation of rights. Additionally, Andrew J. Bacevich recently suggested President George W. Bush may have been a “true believer” in “Operation Enduring Freedom” and “Operation Iraqi Freedom”, while Donald H. Rumsfield and Dick Cheney may have had other plans for U.S. involvement in the Middle East.4
Subsequent events would seem to indicate that there are other forces at play and that the Muslim terrorists alone are not the Gadianton robbers to which President Hinckley made reference.5 Perhaps his remarks should be viewed in a “prophetic context” of the words and statements of past Prophets, Seers and Revelators of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
Sources:
- Hinckley, Gordon B. “The Times in Which We Live“. November 2001. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. 9 November 2008.↩
- Hinckley, Gordon B. “Our Testimony to the World.”May 1997. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. 9 November 2008.↩
- Hinckley, Gordon B. “The Work Goes On.” May 2001. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. 9 November 2008.↩
- See Bacevich on U.S. Foreign Policy After Iraq. See the full series of videos for this specific reference.↩
- This sentence was updated on 10 Nov 2008 with the qualifier “alone” to convey the thought that the terrorists – and more specifically the group backing the terrorists – do not fit the full definition of Gadianton robbers per President Hinckley’s description.↩
Tags: 9/11, Andrew J. Bacevich, Gadianton Robbers, Gordon B. Hinckley
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Anthony Larson
on November 10, 2008 at 5:08 am
You misread Pres. Hinckley’s remarks. The terrorists ARE the modern equivalent of the Nephite’s Gadianton Robbers. That’s why he addressed the issue and referenced the robbers in the wake of 9/11. While there are those within our nation that conspire, it is the threat from without that brought down the towers and seeks our destruction yet. You, like most Saints, misread the Nephite story. The Gadiantons ultimately separated from Nephite society to become an outlaw element. They hid in caves in the wilderness. They came out in force to pillage and plunder. They took hostages and sought to spread fear and terror.
While we have plenty to fear from enemies within, as you note, we must also be diligent about the enemies without. The Nephites had them both; so do we.
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Greg
on November 10, 2008 at 10:29 pm
Hi Anthony – thank you for your comments. I agree with all of the major points you mention above. The terrorists ARE the modern equivalent of the Gadianton robbers. However, I do not believe that Al Qaeda – who supposedly backed the terrorists – are necessarily all the robbers to which President Hinckley referred.
Neither the terrorists, nor Al Qaeda and the Muslim countries which harbor them, have been shown to have an interest in destroying the Church or to have tried to “woo the people with sophistry.” They simply do not meet all the criteria which President Hinckley mentioned. Consequently, I think we have to look at other groups which meet these criteria.
You might enjoy “Prophets, Principles and National Survival” if you can find a copy at a bookstore that carries used books.
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Marc
on January 13, 2009 at 10:48 am
Rememer, The gadiantons were nephites and eventually gained sole manangement of the nephite govt’ by seduction and deception. Bid Laden could never pull off such a thing in America. Not a chance!
The Jaredites and Nephites were both destroyed by “internal combinations”.
To all those who believe in the “war on terror” You are being deceived. Read your BOM again and ponder it’s meaning.
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Greg
Thank you for your interesting comments Marc. However, I am not sure that the Gadiantons were in fact Nephites. Years ago I remember doing research for a BYU professor on all the proper names in the Book of Mormon and if I remember correctly, Gadianton and Kishkumen were probably not Nephite names, which may give us a clue to our present situation.
Concerning your comment about “internal combinations”, I tend to agree. I think the prophets and apostles have been clear about this over the years (for one example, see The Enemy Within). I also agree that it is highly unlikely that Bin Laden and Al Qaeda – if in fact they were responsible – working alone, could pull off such a thing in America.
Like you, I also believe there has been a lot of disinformation about the apparent “war on terror”, which in itself is an interesting choice of words used to mobilize a country against a perceived outside threat.
Additional posts on this subject can be found tagged Constitution, Conspiracy, and Gadianton Robbers.
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michael
on November 1, 2009 at 9:49 pm
The enemy is much closer to home than you think. It excists within this church. President
Benson made reference of it.There are many many in the church especially in Utah who been setteling Utah for generations. They pretend to be very good mormons and include Stake Presidents and Bishops. Especially in Ogden and many in Salt Lake as well.
I can’t say right now how I know this but the brethren are partially aware of it.
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Gregg S
on November 8, 2009 at 10:55 pm
A few years ago I read the Book of Mormon highlighting all the references to secret combinations (and related). I gained a new understanding from this experience.
First, it made me aware of how prevalent this topic is throughout the book. When you aren’t looking, you tend not to notice the extent. It opened my eyes to this. The Book of Mormon was written for our day. There is a reason this subject gets so much coverage. Mormon foresaw that we would be dealing with this threat, and was trying to warn us and help us. The 2 previous inhabitants of this chosen land (Jaredites and Nephites) were destroyed because of secret combinations (Ether 8:21). Will we be the 3rd?
Second, although gangs, drug cartels, mafia and terrorists are a form of secret combinations, they are not the principal one we need to worry about, nor are they the most threatening to our liberties and freedom. In the Book of Mormon the secret combinations didn’t just rob, plunder and harass the people, they sought to infiltrate and then take over the government. Almost without exception this was their primary target. If you wanted to have the most control and influence over the most people, how would you do this? You would seek control of government. Satan fully understands this and this is where he can have the greatest impact. When wicked people rule, the laws are changed, the righteous are oppressed and work of the Lord is severely impeded. The war in heaven didn’t end when we came to earth. The battle over agency and freedom rages on.
Lastly, remember that in the end before their final destruction, the Nephites had almost all fallen into wickedness (we don’t read about a group being spared). They had been lulled into building up and supporting the secret combinations. They were blinded by their pride, they started fighting “offensive” instead of “defensive” wars (this is what caused Mormon to resign as their military leader), many of them were personally benefiting from the system in power. They thought they were doing better than they really were. They didn’t see it coming.
I worry that we are being swept up into the same reasoning. We are building up, supporting and allowing unrighteous people to rule us. The laws are being changed, we are losing important freedoms, but it happens so slowly and incrementally that we don’t realize it is happening. There is a growing socialistic, freedom destroying philosophy and system that is spreading across the country. With so many people who are sustained, supported and employed by it, it undermines our collective ability to identify it for what it is and make the necessary corrections before it is too late. Are we being lulled into a false sense of security? Are we following the same path the Jaredites and Nephites followed? And just like them we somehow feel we are above this. This could never happen to us. The Lord wouldn’t allow this to happen. The only thing the Lord won’t allow, is for his church to be destroyed from off the earth, but that guarantee doesn’t extend to all its members (were there not members of the church in the days of Mormon and Moroni? What happened to them in the final battle? Why were they also destroyed?).
It gives some powerful food for thought.
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Greg
Thanks for your comments Gregg S. You might enjoy reading my notes about the Gadianton Robbers. There seem to have been many such groups identified by this epithet in the Book of Mormon. However, they all appear to have shared a common interest as you suggest above.
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Gregg S
I am looking forward to reading more from your website. There are a number of topics that peek my interest. I noticed an article by High Nibley on “Wealth” and that reminds me of an excerpt I came across a couple years ago from Bro. Nibley entitled “Pre-emptive War” (14 min. MP3 file). It reinforced some of the feelings and suspicions I have had regarding war, from my readings in the Book of Mormon. I would imagine you have heard or read his thoughts and perhaps have a post on this topic. I would enjoy reading your comments. Thank you for the excellent resources.
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michael
The worldwide secret combination mentioned in Ether that would excist in the latter days included the communists as President Benson once said. I believe it excisted before the communists took over Russia. If you go to jrnyquist.com you will find much information (Podcasts) concerning russia and china and how they have always been linked stongly with the terrorists from the very beginning. The same communists are still in power in Russia today.
On the home page at the bottom on the left side is a list of podcasts of interveiws with various experts on Russia and other topics. On another page (www.jrnyquist.com/rss/jrnpodcast.xml) is a list of these same podcasts plus many more. One in particular included an interview with a former official of the CIA. One of the things he mentioned was on the day of the bombings of the twin towers the cabs which are always lined up on the street there and which are mostly operated by middle easterners were absent that day.
The Russians and Chineese are also closely tied to Iran and Chevez and other dictators and they are all associated with terrorists from the Middle East and South America. Also notice how Obama has sided with these dictators and against democracies like Honduras. It has been found that the Hondurans followed their constitution in removing the dictator there and I believe Obama knew it from the very beginning.
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michael
I also wanted to mention that the podcasts work perfectly well on a dial-up connection as well.
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Greg
Thanks Gregg S. I am pretty familiar with most of Nibley’s published material, but have not heard his thoughts about preemptive war, unless it comes from one of his existing articles. Do you happen to have a copy or a source on the web?
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Gregg S
Here is the info on Nibley’s “Pre-emptive War”. Apparently it is an excerpt from BYU Studies Vol. 25, 1985.
This link contains the text:
http://principlesofliberty.blogspot.com/2008/07/christianity-and-preemptive-war.htmlAnd from this link you can download the talk: (scroll down toward the bottom of the list)
http://www.latterdayconservative.com/downloads/otherThere are a number of great talks available on this site from Pres. Benson, Cleon Skousen and others.
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Greg
Thanks Gregg S. I have read this quote by Nibley and also follow Gabriel and the Principles of Liberty on Twitter. It is an excellent site. Ditto about Brian’s Latterday Conservative site.
Although this site shares many similarities with these other two sites, Believe All Things tries to provide a broad range of perspectives that are not easily classified as “conservative” or “libertarian”.
Regardless, these are excellent sites that contain wonderful resources.
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grego
on November 23, 2009 at 12:02 am
Nice three points from President Hinckley’s talk!
I have related posts at bookofmormonnotes.com (use search to find your favorite 911/ Gadianton robbers/ preemptive strike/ King Noah/ propaganda/ political post).
As to what made the acts on that day “consummate evil” (talk about sophistry in speech!!–as if this could even compare to, say, Dresden, or take your pick of many other events), I believe as some others here have mentioned that it wasn’t any Muslim group, but a group much more dangerous: http://bookofmormonnotes.wordpress.com/2009/09/02/book-of-mormon-amalickiah-offers-insights-into-911-terrorist-attacks-by-grego/
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Tony
on January 26, 2010 at 9:54 am
Greg,
Thank you for your posts. While I’m not sure that we’ll ever know the full extent of who exactly was behind 9/11, I share your opinion that it is highly unlikely that Al Qaeda/Bin Laden were solely responsible for the attacks.
Like Gregg S. shared above, the Book of Mormon contains so many references to secret combinations, all in an effort to warn us (Ether 8: 23-24). I can’t help but think back to Alma 47 where we learn of Amalickiah’s fraud of the people to gain their hearts. We have certainly seen similar types throughout history…a wicked leader(s) employing deception to create fear/anger among his own people, all in an effort to assume greater control over them. Hitler and the Reichstag fire immediately comes to mind.
I hate to think that some members of our own government could have had anything to do with 9/11. However, I am not naive to the possibility and am troubled by some of the 9/11 byproducts, particularly the quickly produced, 1000-page Patriot Act…a document that endangers individual freedom in exchange for a promise of security.
While I certainly can’t say with any certainty that 9/11 was an “inside job”, I am also mindful of the words of Thomas Paine when he said, “The greatest tyrannies are always perpetrated in the name of the noblest causes.” Certainly is food for thought.
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sue maxwell
on April 16, 2010 at 11:05 am
I knew Cory Ten Boom. In her book she notes that her brother went to Germany to study at the college level. When he came home he said that there were dangerous things being taught that would bring trouble. So education is another area of infiltration that causes a gradual change in the way in which people think. The Huminist Manifestos, numbers 1 and 2 are very informative to read. You get a clue as to why our education system is a mess.
Herbert Philbrick was in the Young Communist League Front group for quite awhile before they finally became open as to who they were and invited him in. They had a campaign to attract others who were unsuspecting. People who have had the influence of humanistic thinking in their lives, are more drawn to things that are wrong. But there are people who are just plain evil, malicious, and have a desire to control and destroy. The devils is still around, working in his various ways- covertly and less so. We fight against principalities and powers in high places. He is the real enemy, and some people can be rescued. That is shown in the book about the life of Abraham Vereide, who was a Christian that converted subversive government men in Seattle and started International Christian Leadership. Also, has anyone read “From Mafffia to Mormon?”
Hasn’t the news shown us that there have been conspiritors in this country who have helped Bin Laden. He is highly organized- you have to be to pull off that kind of thing. I was in the airport that day, and was going to go to NYC, and my twin uncles live there and watched it happen. My first thought was the verse in Ether 8:24 “…..when ye see shall these things come among you that ye shall awake to a sense of your awful condition, because of this secret combination which shall be among you…….” It is interesting that this is not plural. It could be that all secret combinations are combined in some manner, or that there are many that work for the same purpose- to get power and gain. Or that the internal ones, being connected with others, who go for government control are the most dangerous.
There is an article I just received from the US Border Controll that is absolutely frightening in its possibilites as the border is not safe and full amnesty is about to be give to all aliens. There is so much in this article, but I don’t know how to foward it.
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sue maxwell
In regards to the video on Skull and Bones, and the fact that George Bush, a member of that group, came into office and then there was an astonishing attack on this country, I am wondering if there is a relationship there? Considering that the idea is to manage conflict, for the purpose of power and gain, has caused me to relook at that situation in a different light. If these men promote even war, to manage conflict, it seems like a possibility that I never would have considered until after I saw that video interview.
I have read a good bit about Communist infiltration in this country, as well as the influence of humanism, but the warning of Moroni is about a secret combination among us- singular- not plural- and among us. Sueth
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sue maxwell
Is there a way to edit your remarks, once sent in? My computer is doing strange things- like Sueth- I am really Sue, and it is leaving off last letters on everything I write.
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Greg
No, but I may try to find a plugin to add this functionality sometime in the future.
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sue maxwell
The other day I thought of something sort of strange. We call 911 for emergencies. 9/11 is the same number. Is this a sort of warning to us- time to call upon God because we are in trouble? Or is there some sort of strange coincidence or planned timing in it? I know that sounds a bit paranoid, but after reading many things about what is behind war and terror, I wouldn’t doubt most anything any more!
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Darren Andrews
on May 6, 2010 at 3:25 am
I have been putting together some quotations from Church leaders on the issue of modern-day Gadianton Robbers (titles are my own wording). They are in chronological order:
A secret band will sap the strength of America in the last days
“I have seen the end of this nation and it is terrible. I will tell you in the name of the LORD that a secret band will sap the life of this nation.”(Apostle Moses Thatcher, 1882, Journal of Discourses 20:318)
We are in the midst of great propaganda and even the elect are being deceived
“We are in the midst of the greatest exhibition of propaganda that the world has ever seen. Just do not believe all you read or hear. The elect are being deceived.” (J. Reuben Clark, Conference Report, October 1941)
A global tyranny to be established by stealth in the last days
“Satan…[plans] to destroy liberty and freedom ~ economic, political, and religious, and to set up in place thereof the greatest, most widespread, and most complete tyranny that has ever oppressed men. He is working under such perfect disguise that many do not recognize either him or his methods.” (First Presidency, General Conference, October 1942)
Modern-day Gadiantons being blindly elected/appointed to government
“The Gadianton Robbers from the Book of Mormon are loose among us. The King-men, and women, are running our government. And, worst of all, we are blindly electing them, or appointing them so they can continue to destroy the things we cherish most.” (John Widtsoe, General Conference, April 1944)
Government & Church to suffer “vacant places” due to the Conspiracy
“If the conspiracy comes here it will probably come in its full vigor and there will be a lot of vacant places among those who guide and direct, not only this government, but also this Church of ours.” (J. Reuben Clark, Conference Report, April 1944)
Satan has control now and is guiding the governments of the world
“Satan has control now. No matter where you look, he is in control, even in our own land. He is guiding the governments as far as the Lord will permit him. That is why there is so much strife, turmoil, confusion all over the earth. One master mind is governing the nations. It is not the President of the United States…it is not the king or government of England or any other land; it is Satan himself.” (Joseph Fielding Smith, Doctrines of Salvation, Vol. 3, pp. 314-315)
Socialism-communism is a conspiracy
“…we should accept the command of the Lord and treat socialistic communism as the tool of Satan. We should follow the counsel of the President of the Church and resist the influence and policies of the socialist-communist conspiracy wherever they are found–in the schools, in the churches, in governments, in unions, in businesses, in agriculture.” (Ezra Taft Benson, Conference, October 1961)
A vast, worldwide secret combination to seek to overthrow all lands
“Concerning the United States, the Lord revealed to his prophets that its greatest threat would be a vast, worldwide ‘secret combination’ which would not only threaten the United States but also seek to ‘overthrow the freedom of all lands, nations…’(Ether 8:25)” (Ezra Taft Benson, Conference, October 1961)
A deliberate conspiracy to destroy the U.S. Constitution exists
“And do not think that these usurpations, intimidations, and impositions are being done to us through inadvertence or mistake; The whole course is deliberately planned and carried out; its purpose is to destroy the Constitution and our constitutional government; then to bring chaos, out of which the new Statism with its slavery is to arise, with a cruel, relentless, selfish, ambitious crew in the saddle, riding hard with whip and spur, a red-shrouded band of night riders for despotism.” (Church News PPNS, 1949, pg. 327)
Socialist-communist conspiracy at work both at home and abroad
“Our priceless heritage is threatened today as never before in our lifetime: from without by the forces of Godless Communism, and at home by our complacency and by the insidious forces of the Socialist-Communist conspiracy, with the help of those who would abandon the ancient landmarks set by our fathers and take us down the road to destruction. It was Alexander Hamilton who warned that ‘nothing is more common than for a free people, in times of heat and violence, to gratify momentary passions, by letting into the government, principles and precedents which afterwards prove fatal to themselves.’ (Alexander Hamilton and the Founding of the Nation, p. 462.)” (Ezra Taft Benson, General Conference, April 1968)
There is no conspiracy theory in the Book of Mormon
“This most correct book on earth states that the downfall of two great American civilizations came as a result of secret conspiracies whose desire was to overthrow the freedom of the people. “And they have caused the destruction of this people of whom I am now speaking,” says Moroni, “and also the destruction of the people of Nephi.” (Eth. 8:21.) Now undoubtedly Moroni could have pointed out many factors undoubtedly Moroni could have pointed out many factors that led to the destruction of the people, but notice how he singled out the secret combinations, just as the Church today could point out many threats to peace, prosperity, and the spread of God’s work, but it has singled out the greatest threat as the great conspiracy. There is no conspiracy theory in the Book of Mormon –it is a conspiracy fact. And along this line I would highly recommend to you the book None Dare Call It Conspiracy by Gary Allen.” (Ezra Taft Benson, General Conference, April 1972; book recommendation added by Ezra Taft Benson during talk after he discovered a Russian delegation was in attendance. Not included in the prepared or text archives of the talk).
Modern founders of secret works arose about same time as Restoration
“It is well to ask, what system [referring to Isaiah 29:15-16] established secret works of darkness to overthrow nations by violent revolution? Who blasphemously proclaimed the atheistic doctrine that God made us not? Satan works through human agents. We need only look to some of the ignoble characters in human history who were contemporary to the restoration of the gospel to discover fulfillment of Isaiah’s prophecy. I refer to the infamous founders of Communism and others who follow in their tradition…” (Ezra Taft Benson, A Witness and a Warning, Conference, October 1979)
Gadianton robbers fills the seats in many governments
“Gadianton robbers fill the judgement seats in many nations. An evil power seeks to overthrow the freedom of all nations and countries.” (Apostle Bruce R. McConkie, speaking in the April 1980 General Conference)
A specific secret combination is increasing its global dominion
“[Wickedness] is more highly organized, more cleverly disguised, and more powerfully promoted than ever before. Secret combinations lusting for power, gain, and glory are flourishing. A secret combination that seeks to overthrow the freedom of all lands, nations, and countries is increasing its evil influence and control over America and the entire world.” (Ezra Taft Benson, I Testify, Conference, October 1988).
Evil schemers promote heavy taxation, false promises, loose morals, war
“The Book of Mormon narrative is a chronicle of nations long since gone. But in its descriptions of the problems of today’s society, it is as current as the morning newspaper and much more definitive, inspired, and inspiring concerning the solutions of those problems. I know of no other writing which sets forth with such clarity the tragic consequences to societies that follow courses contrary to the commandments of God. Its pages trace the stories of two distinct civilizations that flourished on the Western Hemisphere. Each began as a small nation, its people walking in the fear of the Lord. But with prosperity came growing evils. The people succumbed to the wiles of ambitious and scheming leaders who oppressed them with burdensome taxes, who lulled them with hollow promises, who countenanced and even encouraged loose and lascivious living. These evil schemers led the people into terrible wars that resulted in the death of millions and the final and total extinction of two great civilizations in two different eras.” (Gordon B. Hinckley, First Presidency Message, Ensign, August 2005)
Discussion here: http://www.ldsfreedomforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=11709
Thanks for a great blog. I’ve visited this site often over the years!
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Greg
Thanks for the additional information regarding modern-day equivalents of the Gadianton robbers Darren. Quite a lot to ponder.
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kh
on May 6, 2010 at 5:10 pm
I have read the book President Benson recommended, “None Dare Call It Conspiracy.” It was amazing! Every high government position here and elswhere are filled with the New World Order conspirators. They all seek Global tyranny at the expense of all of us. I recommend the youtube “the Obama deception.” very well done. I have seen several articles on the demonic endowment that the members of the Skull and Bones group go thru at Yale University. Both President Bushes and Bill Clinton went thru them. Claimed to be the same covenants that Cain made with Luficer. Truly these evil secret combinations are ready to make their move to world power and control. The great thing is that truth will prevail! The Kingdom of God will roll forth.
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Greg
Interesting comments kh. Having read the same book, for some reason it didn’t seem to convey the idea that “Every high government position here and elswhere are filled with the New World Order conspirators.” This seems implausible when sweeping pronouncements are made which use words such as “every” and “all.”. No doubt there are likely the “honest in heart” in many government positions of responsibility.
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sue maxwell
I have read all of these books also and plenty more. I think the main issue is not who is doing it but what do we do about it.
Here is a similar issue. I heard that all of our facebook profiles were being made public. I found my entire page on the net. I found all my friends profiles, also. So I spent two days reading everything about the owner- mark Zuckerburg, and his intentions, and the legal dangers of facebook, plus copyright issues and it was so scary that I immediately got off. And you can’t get off- he owns and will use as he wants to, everything you have put on there- photos, conversations, the whole thing. And he isn’t a nice guy- he is a creep and a liar.
There are so many groups that fit all of this, but Moroni said that when we see these things come upon us we need to wake up to the awfulness of our situation and do something about it. Discussing it helps, but how about some ideas of what to do about it all.
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Darren Andrews
I believe FB was funded by venture funds put forward by the CIA.
Glad you liked the quotations. You can check that link I gave to see 26 points regarding the nature of the Gadiantons in the Book-of-Mormon.
None Dare Call It Conspiracy is a great primer for getting people to see the puppet master behind the various Hegelian dialectics of our day. I wish every LDS would read it. We need to wake up as a people. Too many of us still allow the world to think for us. This book was “highly” recommended by Ezra Taft Benson in the April 1972 Conference of the Church.
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sue maxwell
What do you mean that FB was funded by the “venture funds” put foward by the CIA? I would really like to know what you are talking about. I spent over two days reading a tremendous amount of information about Mark Zuckerberg, his past, his desire to change and take over the internet, how he says that he believes that people want less privacy on the internet. He seems to be unstoppable. There are four Senators and a government agency after him. A major Maffia criminal, who has been long sought after, was caught on facebook, there have been a murder and a rape— on and on and on. I am warning all of my friends about it. This creepy kid is out to expose everyone’s personal lives on the net, and to sell information and photos to others to use in whatever way they want to. It is dangerous to say the least, and once off, you are not off, as they retain the rights to all you put on the site, which is in their files.
My remark about continually discussing things was not meant to be disparaging. I simply mean that I think there are things we need to discuss about how to deal with the problems our country faces. Light and Truth chase darkness. People know so little about what is behind all that is happening in this country, and know so little about our founding principles, that it seems that anything positive we can do will help.
Cleon Skoussen started the group called The National Center for Constitutional Studies. It has some very good ideas, as well as books, which I suppose that most of you have read. We need more schools of various levels like George Wythe University, which teaches from original documents. We need a generation of students who understand all of the things that are discussed on this site. The only people who can save this country, if not by blood, are those who are educated in true principles and have courage to make a difference.
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Greg
Darren may be referring to articles such as Friends like these… that appeared on The Guardian in January 2008. According to the story:
Facebook’s most recent round of funding was led by a company called Greylock Venture Capital, who put in the sum of $27.5m. One of Greylock’s senior partners is called Howard Cox, another former chairman of the NVCA, who is also on the board of In-Q-Tel. What’s In-Q-Tel? Well, believe it or not (and check out their website), this is the venture-capital wing of the CIA. After 9/11, the US intelligence community became so excited by the possibilities of new technology and the innovations being made in the private sector, that in 1999 they set up their own venture capital fund, In-Q-Tel, which “identifies and partners with companies developing cutting-edge technologies to help deliver these solutions to the Central Intelligence Agency and the broader US Intelligence Community (IC) to further their missions”.
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sue maxwell
Cutting edge technology I can understand, but this group is now allowing personal information to be snatched up by anybody, good or bad. And it is already happening. Japan is making millions off of several games. Japan has its own Maffia, that few people know about. It is nearly bigger than Google, and has had several offers. Mark is a Jew, who throws Jews off of the site and is supporting Palestinian causes. I read so much information and the more I read the more it smelled like something criminal is going on. He is a little criminal to say the least. I tried to find info on who is backing him, but the only thing I found is the ads and a former friend who invested a large amount of money.
Anyway, I know this is a bit off topic, but anything that is a take over fits in I think. I remember reading, several months ago, the analysis that Cleone Skoussen made of the various types of socialism, which included Communism. I had never heard that anaylis before and would have to hunt on my emails for it.
Greg- Dick Eastman’s genealogy letter was the first I heard about the now public profiles. After finding mine, I got off. Then I looked at his- it shows about five photos of friends and their interests. Clicking on them, I found one person after another whose sole interest were these Maffia games and I could go from one person to another, finding real Maffia looking types. After reading articles about who is tracking you on FB, I told him what I found and he got off. You might want to consider it also, as your political view may be being tracked by people you don’t want to know about them. It is up to you, but you could not pay me to be on it now. Sue
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Darren Andrews
Yes, I was referring to that – I have *not* checked it out so please do your own research – which is why I said I “believe”.
That sure is some horrible stuff about that guy. Is there a good web site I could point FB friends to that encapsulates all this? I joined FB because a friend wanted to keep in contact. I hardly ever use it – though I am now in contact with some good groups (such as Shiloh Logan’s BYU Freedom Society) via FB.
I think, certainly in my stake, parents and leaders have concerns about FB – from the perspective of gossip, youth, time-wasting etc. If they knew the darker side they might take it more seriously.
Sue, I agree. I came across the NCCS years ago and have read most of Skousen’s works as well as others such as H. Verlan Andersen, Joel Skousen (who can tell you some things about the CIA) and pretty much all the political writings and speeches of Benson, Clark, Romney, McKay, etc. Stephen Pratt is good (former assistant to Cleon) too.
I agree we need people who understand the principles – studying all the “secret combination” stuff is important only inasmuch as it helps one identify the need to more fully understand, promote and defend what is right – the Constitution, natural rights, limited government, the free market, sovereignty, the family, et. al.
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sue maxwell
I don’t know of another site- there are similar ones but they are all linking up; the fact that this kid is making your info more and more public really scares me. I have warned some friends, but it is such a good way to network, that they don’t want to leave it. I think we all have a bit of naievity (sp) about things- we are very trusting people. We need to be discerning. I admit I miss it but I do have other things I need to do that are really more important.
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max
on June 25, 2010 at 9:47 pm
Gregg S, your November 8, 2009 at 10:55 pm comments are right on target. bravo.
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sue maxwell
Well, I just read that FB is going to make access to everything on the net like Google does and that they are bigger than Google. Google has changed quite a bit recently. Someone from Google works for FB and so does someone from the government. What are the implications of all of this? Now there are 1billion people on this site and he is interconnecting everyone. If the government is about to pass a law that will make it impossible for the names of petition signers to be private- what are all of these implications, including the fact that the government is going to try to take over the net. And they are now after Glen Beck seriously to get him off the air.
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sue maxwell
I think I better reword this. What are the implications of the following items? I read recently that some top person from Google is now on the staff of FB, as is a goverment official; I read that FB is moving to allow access to items on the internet that I usually Google looking for information; I read that Google is going to do something similar to FB; I found a spot on FB where they created a profile of me and tried to entice me to add info to it. Also, considering that there have been many articles about the governments intentions to regulate the internet, who can say what on the net and on tv and radio. I have signed many petitions so I would be classified as an enemy of our present government. What is really going on with FB which now has 1 billion members and growing?
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sue maxwell
no the spot was on Google where a profile was created of me- sorry
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Faanunu
on August 28, 2010 at 9:42 am
When we fight… it must be according to our laws and within the boundaries the Lord has set. For us americans it is the US Constitution that we must follow. The modern day Gadianton robbers should be distinguished from modern day “lamanites”. The terrorists do so out of “traditions and teaching of their fathers” and not by deceiving and lying to the people as do the robbers. If you wish to see a robber just see who does not obey the Constitution and shreds it.
We are at war with both the lamanites and Gadiantons and must deal with them in the like manner.
I pray that we might learn from my ancestors in the Book of Mormon, repent and remain freemen.
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